Mandy Kaplan:
Hello, everybody, and welcome to Make Me a Nerd. I’m Mandy Kaplan, a mainstream mom whose mission it is to explore the world of nerd culture that I’ve been missing out on and afraid of my whole life.
Hey, anybody new to the podcast? If you are, this is how this all works. I get approached by one of my dear nerd friends or colleagues or strangers — I’ve had a lot of strangers on lately.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah.
Mandy Kaplan:
And they say, “Hey Mandy, you should know about this.” They come on the podcast and try to get me to become nerdy about what it is they love. Today, King of the Nerds, he’s back. Is this a fourth time for you?
Jimmy Aquino:
I think fourth or fifth, yeah.
Mandy Kaplan:
Fourth or fifth?
Jimmy Aquino:
Maybe, yeah.
Mandy Kaplan:
Yes.
Jimmy Aquino:
When do I get my green jacket, like an SNL, or the blue jacket?
Mandy Kaplan:
Oh, I wish I could afford it. I don’t have any money.
Jimmy Aquino:
Oh.
Mandy Kaplan:
Everybody knows and loves him. He is the host of Comic News Insider, creator of, host of, producer of. Jimmy Aquino is back.
Jimmy Aquino:
Well, thank you so much for having me back. I appreciate it. I always love nerding out with you. And I have to say, I was thinking about this the other day. I’m really proud of you that you started this, because it is a really nice challenge to yourself — you’re just like, “I want to learn about something I don’t know much about and get people to help me along the way.” And you’ve been converted somewhat to a lot of it, which is great.
Mandy Kaplan:
Too much of it, which is — to my surprise, how much I’ve really loved. And this came about very organically because my nerdy friend, you, contacted me after listening to my Hunger Games episode.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah, ripoff.
Mandy Kaplan:
I did two episodes on Hunger Games.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yes, uh-huh, yeah.
Mandy Kaplan:
And you reached out and said, “Do you know the Hunger Games, a lot of people believe, is a ripoff of a movie from 2001 called Battle Royale?” And I answered typically, “Eh?” And so you said, “Watch it and let’s nerd out about that.” And I’m so glad you did. This was not on my radar.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah. It’s a Japanese film from like 2000, 2001. It wasn’t really released here till much later because there’s a lot of red tape in the release. But us being in theater, we did a lot of theater, and a lot of my friends were dancers and they were from Japan. I remember them would tell me about things, sometimes give me bootleg things. I think I saw the bootleg first in all Japanese, not understanding five words, back then around 2002 or something like that.
Mandy Kaplan:
Yeah.
Jimmy Aquino:
And then I got another bootleg that had the translations, and I eventually saw it when it came in theaters here like ten years later. But it’s one of the first — probably not the first. It’s based on a novel that came out the year before in ’99 by Koushun Takami. It’s just sort of one of the first big ones.
Tarantino said it was like one of the best ones of the past two or three decades when he saw it. All sorts of big people love it, and it sort of spawned this generation of movies like Hunger Games. And although their name, Collins, claims she never read the book or heard of it when she turned hers in — I’m like, well, there’s so many similarities, so maybe, but I don’t know.
Mandy Kaplan:
Yes, and it’s funny you said Tarantino, because a lot of the violence in this is very Tarantino-esque to me. You know, nothing’s happening, everybody’s laughing, and then a head explodes. It’s very shocking, cartoonish, funny, but also horrifying and sick and gross. And the things that make me able to stand the violence in Tarantino.
And spoiler alert in this movie. For those of you who are saying, “What do you mean it’s a Hunger Games inspiration?” Here’s the log line, you judge for yourself. Forty-two ninth graders are sent to a deserted island. They are given a map, food, and various weapons. An explosive collar is fitted around their neck. If they break a rule, the collar explodes. Their mission — kill each other and be the last ones standing. The last survivor is allowed to leave the island. If there is more than one survivor, the collars explode and kill them all.
Jimmy Aquino:
No winners. Yeah. So what’s great about this film also is that it gives that in the first five minutes, and then you’re right in. It explains in captions what the Battle Royale Act is. It’s an act that the Japanese government put together, like, as kids are jerks and it’s gotten out of hand. Eight hundred thousand students, I think it said, had basically dropped out of school and were causing havoc, and juvenile delinquency was huge, and violence.
So they were like, “Well, we’re going to teach you a lesson by randomly picking a ninth grade class every year, kidnapping you, gassing you, and then you’re going to wake up on this random island, and you’re going to have to kill each other. And you have three days to do it.” And then, like Mandy said, these are certain rules you have to follow.
Mandy Kaplan:
Chim Chiminy, Chim Chiminy. I mean, it is really, it is horrifically violent.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah, then it jumps within five minutes into it.
Mandy Kaplan:
Before they even go there — you said it happens in the first five minutes, but before the premise kicks in, this movie starts with a suicide, and then a teacher getting stabbed.
Jimmy Aquino:
Oh yeah.
Mandy Kaplan:
That’s what really happens. And then I have a million questions about the actual opening of the film. Pete, if you would please put up this picture. When I looked up the film, this is what came up — this picture of the little girl who’s bloody and smiling and holding a dolly.
Jimmy Aquino:
The previous winner from the previous Battle Royale.
Mandy Kaplan:
So you just answered all my questions. Okay.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah.
Mandy Kaplan:
But that picture that everyone can see now on your phones as you’re listening is so mesmerizing to me. She’s adorable and childlike, and yet there seems to now be an evil behind her eyes.
Jimmy Aquino:
Look, she killed people to survive, so yeah.
Mandy Kaplan:
Yeah, absolutely.
Jimmy Aquino:
Her friends, you know.
Mandy Kaplan:
Okay, so full disclosure, I didn’t get that that was last year’s winner, and I was so confused.
Jimmy Aquino:
Ah. They do kind of say it in the beginning because the reporter says something about like, “Oh, this year’s winner,” or something like that. And it sort of sets it up.
Mandy Kaplan:
“It’s a girl” is what the reporter says.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah, yeah. Oh, and she’s smiling.
Mandy Kaplan:
Yes, but I guess I blinked, because then the next thing that happened, I thought was a flashback to how we got to the little girl winning.
Jimmy Aquino:
Mmm.
Mandy Kaplan:
So I the whole time was trying to find her, and there are 42 different characters, and sometimes you think you get to know one, and then they’re dead.
Jimmy Aquino:
Oh, I see. You thought she was going to be the winner. I see. They go quickly sometimes.
Mandy Kaplan:
So the whole time, I was like, “I thought a little girl won this whole thing. Where is she?”
Jimmy Aquino:
What a surprise, then, nice.
Mandy Kaplan:
One of the things I said was, I wish I didn’t know who was going to win. Because it’s spoiling a lot of the fun of rooting for and then mourning, because I was waiting for her to emerge from the other side of the island, like, “Mwa-ha.”
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah, you probably would have understood it better had you watched it in Japanese with English subtitles.
Mandy Kaplan:
But —
Jimmy Aquino:
We’ll gloss right past that. You watched the English dub, right?
Mandy Kaplan:
Jimmy’s a little mad at me, everybody.
Jimmy Aquino:
I’m really mad. Well, here’s the deal. I decided to watch it as well, the English dub.
Mandy Kaplan:
Yeah.
Jimmy Aquino:
I watched the original again. I have like three DVD versions of it. But then I let me fast forward through the English dub. It was awful.
Mandy Kaplan:
It’s hard.
Jimmy Aquino:
The voice acting was terrible.
Mandy Kaplan:
Yeah.
Jimmy Aquino:
And that’s what I think takes me out. As a voice actor — I’m not shaming you, I’m obviously joking with you because I love you — but it takes you out. Maybe you can answer this, as a voice actor: have you done dubs before, or just straight voice acting?
Mandy Kaplan:
Very little work in that arena.
Jimmy Aquino:
I feel like — and correct me if I’m wrong, maybe not in your case — I feel like dubs are basically told, “Just read the script.” Not much acting put behind it. They don’t really direct much.
Mandy Kaplan:
Not anymore.
Jimmy Aquino:
Okay, maybe not anymore.
Mandy Kaplan:
Not anymore.
Jimmy Aquino:
But definitely back then, I feel it has a lot of it.
Mandy Kaplan:
But back then.
Jimmy Aquino:
Because it feels like they were told, “You get one take.” That’s the thing. A lot of it, I feel. I kept fast forwarding through scenes just to watch scenes I wanted to see. And it was just like, this is terrible, and it takes away the emotion from it. Certain scenes, I know — obviously having seen this film probably twenty times over the past twenty-six years since it came out.
I know the Japanese scene where they’re very emotional. And then in the other one, they’re kind of emotional, like the lighthouse scene. The girls are pissed and turning on each other. And the English were like, “Hey, you, you were bad.” It just came across like they’re scolding instead of attacking. And it just bothered me.
And you probably got confused again in another part, because I stopped at one scene too — we’re skipping around, I know, sorry — but where the computer nerds are trying to hack the system, and he’s typing because he knows they can listen. In certain spots of the film, it did pop up English subtitles, so even with the dubs, you could understand what the writing is. Like in the opening suicide scene, it showed what was written on the toilet paper: “You can do it, Shuya, you can do it.”
In this one, he was typing, and nothing appeared. So you probably had no idea what he was typing, right?
Mandy Kaplan:
Not really, no.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah. So in the Japanese with subtitles, it shows he’s typing out ingredients to make a bomb. He wants them to go — that’s why he goes, “Go find the stuff.” It’s like sulfur and all this other stuff. So you’re probably like, “What is he typing?” So that was another glitch in the notes, which happened several times throughout it, I think.
I just think it really takes away from, obviously, the original voice actors and the emotion of it all. I was just left off like, “Oh, I know I’m biased because I love the original.” But I’ve seen other dubs. And you’re right, it has changed, because even some of the Ghibli films over the years, they redubbed them like ten years ago with some really famous actors, like the Fanning sisters and Tom Hanks. Those are really good, because they got real actors.
Mandy Kaplan:
Well, the Spirited Away actors are really, really good.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yes, exactly, were part of that redub.
Mandy Kaplan:
Yeah.
Jimmy Aquino:
So that, I understand. But back then? Rough. Anyway, sorry for this tangent.
Mandy Kaplan:
At its worst — so one thing we haven’t mentioned is that the reason this is all happening, the Battle Royale happens every year. This is supposed to be dystopian, but I have questions about that. There is a teacher, the teacher who gets stabbed. He is behind all of this.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah, he’s a famous Japanese actor.
Mandy Kaplan:
Oh, is he?
Jimmy Aquino:
Beat Takeshi, yeah.
Mandy Kaplan:
A lot of this feels like just a mad scientist experimenting on and murdering children. And he was a fine actor, but the dub was like a lazy Sam Kinison.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yes.
Mandy Kaplan:
And I didn’t understand the choice.
Jimmy Aquino:
Oh my.
Mandy Kaplan:
Like, his voice is a little like this.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah.
Mandy Kaplan:
And it was just like, why did they choose?
Jimmy Aquino:
Well, because the real actor does have sort of a gruff voice, yeah.
Mandy Kaplan:
So that was the dubbing at its worst, but I do have one point where I loved it, but I’ll wait till we get there plot-wise.
Jimmy Aquino:
So I guess he’s trying to emulate —
Mandy Kaplan:
Before the movie starts, they say three different times, “You should not watch this if you are under 15.”
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah.
Mandy Kaplan:
Like, we have PG-13 — this is the Japanese equivalent, but they say it and they mean it.
Jimmy Aquino:
Oh, in Japan it was a big deal. The government tried to come out with statements of how terrible this was. And there were a couple of things that happened years later where a girl did kill a classmate, and it’s because she read the book, or they know she read the book and saw the movie. Like, this twelve-year-old girl killed her classmate. So they’re like, “See what happens, you know?” It was heavily emphasized in Japan for sure.
Mandy Kaplan:
Well, I found a piece of trivia. Many members of the Japanese parliament tried to get the novel banned, but to no avail.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yes.
Mandy Kaplan:
When the film was released, they attempted to ban that also.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah.
Mandy Kaplan:
Both efforts resulted in the novel and the film becoming even more successful, as people bought the book and went to see the movie just to see what all the fuss was about.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah, of course. It’s all like, while this is crazy good, but also frightening.
Mandy Kaplan:
When you forbid something, it makes people want to partake.
Jimmy Aquino:
That’s why I rob and steal all the time.
Mandy Kaplan:
Yeah.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah. I’m the one for several bank robberies. But it is disturbing.
Mandy Kaplan:
Sure.
Jimmy Aquino:
You’re right. And you don’t know if you saw the thing where the writer said he came with the idea in a dream, which you hear from a lot of writers. He saw an actor playing a teacher. So he dreamed of that in the dream. It said something like he was, “All right, class, listen up. Today I’m going to have you guys kill each other.” And he said it with such a smile, and he woke up just like, “I’ve got to do something with this idea. This is crazy.”
Mandy Kaplan:
Yeah.
Jimmy Aquino:
And the director as well, Kinji Fukasaku, said he wanted to direct the film based on the book because it reminded him of an experience he had as a child during World War II. Obviously, we know what happened with Japan in World War II. The government made the kids work at munitions factories. He was 15 years old, and a US Navy warship bombed with artillery, and a lot of the kids were killed. He vividly remembers hiding. They wouldn’t know where to run, so they basically ran into each other, and kids would get killed, they’d hide under the bodies. Then later on, they had to bury their friends. So he’s like, “That always stuck with me, and I had a problem with authority since I was a child. So this really spoke to me.” So it’s pretty intense all around.
Mandy Kaplan:
It’s very intense. And it’s occurring to me that no one can see you, but you are wearing essentially the school uniform of the players.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah.
Mandy Kaplan:
Was that intentional?
Jimmy Aquino:
Maybe I went there. Maybe I survived. Maybe you’ll see me smiling with blood all over me later.
Mandy Kaplan:
Maybe. Let’s see how this goes.
Jimmy Aquino:
That’s right, yeah.
Mandy Kaplan:
So one of the stark reminders that these are schoolchildren is that they are all still in their school uniforms, because they are drugged on a bus, and they are kidnapped. So it’s after school one day. Seeing them all running around this island and bloody and battling each other in their little vests and skirts and stuff from school, it just keeps reminding you.
Jimmy Aquino:
And ties, yeah.
Mandy Kaplan:
It doesn’t let you forget that these are schoolchildren. It’s really —
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah. And most of the actors — well, a few of them were like 15, 16, and the rest were still pretty young, 17 to 21. There were a couple that were like 25, the older ones. But most of them were teenagers that acted in it. They looked really young because they were.
Mandy Kaplan:
And they were very good.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah.
Mandy Kaplan:
When —
Jimmy Aquino:
Many of them have gone on and are still very popular actors.
Mandy Kaplan:
Yeah, that’s one of my questions is about the actors. But so when they wake up from this drug and they’re in — it feels like a classroom or it’s headquarters of some kind. They all wake up and they’re like, “Where are we? What the hell’s going on?” And there are two brooding boy band members off in the corners, both sitting in matching positions.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah.
Mandy Kaplan:
You know, too cool for school. Forgive me, I will get a lot of names wrong.
Jimmy Aquino:
Kawada and Kiriyama, yeah. That’s right.
Mandy Kaplan:
Kawada.
Jimmy Aquino:
Kawada’s the good one.
Mandy Kaplan:
Right.
Jimmy Aquino:
Kiriyama’s the crazy one.
Mandy Kaplan:
Right. And Kiriyama reminded me of JD from Heathers. You know, he’s sitting there brooding and handsome.
Jimmy Aquino:
Oh, you know what? Yeah, kind of. Not as murderous, though, we find — well, luckily we find out. But —
Mandy Kaplan:
Well, then the teacher that they all know stands up and says, “Hey kids, welcome. You’re all going to murder each other.” And of course, it’s like, “Ha ha, what’s really happening?”
Jimmy Aquino:
Like, “Okay, sure,” yeah.
Mandy Kaplan:
I mean, who would believe this? And then somebody speaks up and gets murdered right in front of all their classmates.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah. Well, first they bring out the teacher, don’t they?
Mandy Kaplan:
That’s what I’m saying.
Jimmy Aquino:
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Mandy Kaplan:
The teacher says, “Hey kids, you’re all going to have to murder each other. That’s what’s going on here.”
Jimmy Aquino:
No, no. They bring out their dead teacher.
Mandy Kaplan:
Oh, yes.
Jimmy Aquino:
Remember, in the stretcher.
Mandy Kaplan:
Yes.
Jimmy Aquino:
So that freaks them out.
Mandy Kaplan:
And I thought the only thing scarier than this teacher’s placid smile at the murder is his Tony Soprano tracksuit.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yes.
Mandy Kaplan:
Why is he wearing a Tony Soprano tracksuit?
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah. Because he’s chillin’. He’s just like, “Whatever. Cool.” Because Sabawa — he’s the one that got stabbed by one of the students early on. So he ended up quitting teaching because of it all and got into this program, the Battle Royale Act, because he was pissed at kids, and he thinks they’re the worst. And of course, the kid that stabbed him was one of the kids in this classroom.
Mandy Kaplan:
Right.
Jimmy Aquino:
Which probably had something to do with why that classroom was chosen, I’m sure.
Mandy Kaplan:
Right. But it doesn’t have anything to do with the Tony Soprano tracksuit.
Jimmy Aquino:
Maybe he’s, you know —
Mandy Kaplan:
It’s a weird, weird choice. All the other people are in camo.
Jimmy Aquino:
Well, they’re military.
Mandy Kaplan:
They look like military.
Jimmy Aquino:
He’s not military. He’s part of the government program. Somebody runs it.
Mandy Kaplan:
Wearing like a velour tracksuit, I’m just saying.
Jimmy Aquino:
He runs that particular thing. Maybe he’s part of the Yakuza, and he’s just like, “I’m chillin’, man, whatever. It’s all good.”
Mandy Kaplan:
So we have reached the one voiceover that I absolutely loved, and I’m going to tell you about it right after this.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yes. But the Japanese one is even better, but go ahead.
Mandy Kaplan:
Right after this.
So he puts on a video to show the kids, “Here’s the rules and here’s how it’s all going to go down.”
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah.
Mandy Kaplan:
And it is like an MTV VJ. She’s really cute and hot and adorable, like a morning show host for kids.
Jimmy Aquino:
Almost like an anime character in a sense, almost, yeah.
Mandy Kaplan:
Well, her voice is very much like an anime character.
Jimmy Aquino:
She’s a famous voice actress in Japan, and did many Detective Conan. She’s very famous, and she did a lot of voiceover work, so that’s what she’s known for.
Mandy Kaplan:
Oh, okay.
Jimmy Aquino:
That’s why I wish you would have heard her real voice.
Mandy Kaplan:
Well, she was great.
Jimmy Aquino:
She’s great. I don’t know about the English one, but yeah.
Mandy Kaplan:
And the English one was great because it was so —
Jimmy Aquino:
I think she was good too, yeah. I agree.
Mandy Kaplan:
Freaking creepy. You know, like, “Oh, don’t forget, you get a point if you murder your friends.” And she was on camera, flirting with them.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah. Like a Japanese game show, “Hey, happy, happy, fun time.” Surprisingly enough, Beat Takeshi, the teacher, famously hosted a game show for years in Japan.
Mandy Kaplan:
Oh, really?
Jimmy Aquino:
So that’s why the director was like, “Be yourself in a sense.” Because you’re hosting a game show where kids kill each other. That’s why sometimes he was even kind of like, during the video he’s like, “Yeah, it’s okay, everybody, thank you.” And the creepy smile he would have all the time when somebody died or something menacing happened was just like, “Ooh.”
But she — even the English one, I agree, that’s the only dub I like was English. It’s not as good as the Japanese one, because the Japanese one is super famous voiceover actress, and she’s even more cheery, which makes it even creepier. But this one was good, I think. The English one was good.
Mandy Kaplan:
Yeah, it had the desired effect of chills and revulsion, but also charm and humor.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yes. “Let’s hope you get a good weapon, you know.”
Mandy Kaplan:
Yeah, there’s humor to that. And the video is really cute that she’s like, “We give you food.”
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah.
Mandy Kaplan:
And it’s just a weird stale loaf of bread and water.
Jimmy Aquino:
Like bread.
Mandy Kaplan:
It’s —
Jimmy Aquino:
A flashlight, a map, a compass.
Mandy Kaplan:
Yeah.
Jimmy Aquino:
But also a weapon. Did you notice that she’s happy, happy, lucky, joyful during that, but as soon as she starts reading the names, her face changes. If you notice how much she’s like, “Hey, this is great, blah blah blah. And now I’m going to say the students. Number one, Mandy Kaplan.” And you’re like, whoa, it’s such a shift. It’s so like, “Ooh, you get chills.” It’s really creepy, or like, “Oh, damn.” Really, really good.
Mandy Kaplan:
It was very effective. And that’s totally where this movie succeeds, because it is funny and charming, but horrifying. I like that blend.
Here’s some of my confusion. One brave boy says, “Why are you doing this to the teacher?” And the teacher answers, “You kids mock us. Life is a game. Let’s see if you can make it.” Or something similar — I might have paraphrased a little.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah.
Mandy Kaplan:
That’s not really an answer. I wanted more motivation for doing this from him. I understand he got stabbed at the school and he thinks kids are pains in the asses, but —
Jimmy Aquino:
Let’s be honest, they are.
Mandy Kaplan:
Sure, but there’s a huge leap from, “Oh, I need to go have a drink because these kids drive me crazy,” to “I want to watch them all murder each other.”
Jimmy Aquino:
Oh, is there? I didn’t see that. Well, they explain in the beginning, like, 800,000 kids have left school, and they’ve been causing chaos, and there’s juvenile delinquency and crime and all sorts of stuff.
Mandy Kaplan:
But not these kids.
Jimmy Aquino:
Well, the reason they do it — they chose — he said, “I chose randomly.” So maybe they should find all the bad kids and do it to them, but I think that’s the lesson. Even if you’re good, we don’t want you turning, and this is a lesson to everyone else out there, that it could be any of you. So you better keep it together. You know what I’m saying?
Mandy Kaplan:
Yes, but it is the position of Make Me a Nerd that this should not be done to any kids.
Jimmy Aquino:
No, no, just the really bad ones.
Mandy Kaplan:
You’re right. Those views are expressed by Jimmy Aquino, not Make Me a Nerd.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yes, I support the BR Act. That’s why I’m dressed like this. No, of course not. But I think it’s explained — he’s done. He’s older. He’s dealt with it for years. And he bought into the act. We weirdly see that in real life where people buy into acts and political things. So you never know.
Mandy Kaplan:
I hear that.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah.
Mandy Kaplan:
This is where the acting really came to light for me, because up until then, the kids were acting like kids. They were on a school bus, they were running around, they were gossiping.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah.
Mandy Kaplan:
Now they’ve been told they have to murder each other. And then one by one, they are tossed their backpack and released into the wild to face their fate. Watching them say goodbye to each other and watching them face their reality, it’s —
Jimmy Aquino:
It’s sad. It’s a little tear-jerker in some moments.
Mandy Kaplan:
Very much so. There were two girls holding each other, like, “We’ll always be friends,” and it was —
Jimmy Aquino:
But it happens in a millisecond, because they don’t let them. “Okay, this happens. Cool, let’s go. Move, everybody, move.” So they get to say goodbye in like less than a second, which makes it even sadder.
Mandy Kaplan:
I know how I would have won the Battle Royale, like that.
Jimmy Aquino:
Oh, really? How so?
Mandy Kaplan:
It’s the same method as when I am at a catered event. I stand right by the kitchen door, so that when those trays of appetizers come out, I get them first.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yes, same.
Mandy Kaplan:
So why didn’t someone run out, hide in the bushes, and pick off every kid as they entered the Battle Royale?
Jimmy Aquino:
Exactly. It’s good to know that you immediately had murderous intentions and you didn’t question it at all, so that’s good to know.
Mandy Kaplan:
I love plotting crimes. I don’t love doing them, but I love planning them. Seriously, Jimmy?
Jimmy Aquino:
No, I thought the same thing. I’m like, especially Kiriyama, the crazy one — he got out before a lot of them. Why didn’t he wait for them right away? Maybe he didn’t have a good weapon at first. He was waiting to get a good one.
But that’s the thing too — you could get a random weapon, and they say in the video, it’s not just a gun or a knife. Some people got a gun or a knife or an axe or a crossbow. But our hero Shuya Nanahara, he got a pot lid. And then his Noriko, who becomes his friend — which we didn’t mention — the friend who stabs the teacher is one of the ones that gets killed. He’s made an example of in the classroom before they go to the island, because they’re wearing these necklaces that explode around their neck if they mess up or something happens. So the teacher explodes the necklace, and in the second, he dies.
So that’s his best friend who had a crush on Noriko, and Noriko and Nana run off together because they clearly have feelings for each other. Even though his best friend did — well, whatever, he’s dead now, whatever, it’s fine.
Mandy Kaplan:
No bro code once he’s dead.
Jimmy Aquino:
Also, a woman should be able to make her own choice, right? But anyway, you don’t have to like, “She’s mine, you know, whatever.” Year 2000, so who knows.
But they run off together, and then like I said, it starts immediately — almost right off the door, like you said, it does kind of happen, because the big kid with the crossbow immediately kills somebody. You see this girl coming out of the thing, and she sees Nana, and she’s like, “Nana!” And she has an arrow in her neck. You’re like, “Oh, we have started. It’s immediate.”
Mandy Kaplan:
Now, forgive my ignorance — and I’ll probably say that a lot today and every time we chat like this.
Jimmy Aquino:
Most of your life, it’s fine, it’s okay.
Mandy Kaplan:
Yeah, but his name is — is his first name Shuya, and his last name is Nanahara?
Jimmy Aquino:
In a lot of Asian cultures, last name usually comes first.
Mandy Kaplan:
I was very confused.
Jimmy Aquino:
Actually, in Japanese, is that right? I know in Korean it does. But no, Nanahara is his first name.
Mandy Kaplan:
Nanahara is his first name, but she calls him Shuya.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah, Shuya is his last name, but his best friend calls him that because the best friend, Kuninobu, is his last name.
Mandy Kaplan:
His dad calls him Shuya.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah. Unless I’m completely wrong on that, I’m pretty sure Nana is his first name. And I’ve been known to be wrong.
Mandy Kaplan:
But I got confused because of trying to keep track of 42 kids, and then somebody has two names, and I was like, “Wait, I thought I knew that character. I thought that was Nanahara, but she’s calling him Shuya.”
Jimmy Aquino:
And she says, “I call you that because Nobu, his best friend, called him that.” She’s like, “Is that okay?” And he’s like, “Yeah, you’re cute, I like you, whatever. Call whatever you want.” Not real dialogue, but yeah. I’m pretty sure Nana’s his first name.
Mandy Kaplan:
Okay, thank you for the alleged clarity.
Jimmy Aquino:
I’m pretty sure I’m right, but that’s okay.
Mandy Kaplan:
I want to talk about the music.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yes, really great, right? I loved it. Unless you didn’t. Well, she didn’t. Then no, I hated it.
Mandy Kaplan:
I will let you know right after this.
I initially loved the music. When the movie starts, it’s operatic, it’s cinematic, it does not —
Jimmy Aquino:
It’s Verdi. It’s part of Verdi’s Requiem.
Mandy Kaplan:
There’s a lot of — I caught Bach. Or I don’t — yeah, Bach.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah. Yes.
Mandy Kaplan:
But it does — I thought, “Oh, this movie and this music does not fuck around. Got it.” But then as the kills started, these initial kills, the music felt a little cartoony, like the old Batman series. As these kills were very over the top, the music felt over the top. And I didn’t know if I was being insulting by calling it that. I couldn’t tell if it was working for me and adding to the tension, or if it was making light of this horrific situation.
Jimmy Aquino:
I don’t know, it never really bothered me. It’s like — I guess it’s better than when someone dies, you get — it’s better than that. But like you said, everything — the kills were ridiculous. People would be shot multiple times and get up, and blood would spurt out of them unrealistically. Although, who knows? I’ve never killed anybody that way, so I don’t know if the blood spurts out a certain way or not.
But it was clearly over the top. So maybe it was meant to be. I don’t know. But it didn’t really bother me.
Mandy Kaplan:
The music doesn’t let up. They use actual composers, but then there was a composer of this movie who I think was weaving in their own stuff.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yes, I think so.
Mandy Kaplan:
So some of it’s recognizable, and you start to hum along thinking, “Oh, I know this piece,” and then a lot of it wasn’t. But there was —
Jimmy Aquino:
“Isn’t this Wonderwall by the —”
Mandy Kaplan:
It’s funny, I was going to say, it’s wall-to-wall music. There’s a lot. It just doesn’t let up. And I started loving it, and I left feeling like I’m not sure how I feel about the music.
Jimmy Aquino:
Okay. All right.
Mandy Kaplan:
Does anybody talk about the music? Is that a thing?
Jimmy Aquino:
Just the operatic-ness of it, like with Verdi. How do you say it? Is it Giuseppe Verdi?
Mandy Kaplan:
Verdi, yeah.
Jimmy Aquino:
So Verdi is obviously mentioned — what a juxtaposition of this classical, just in roaring music, to this really fits it.
Mandy Kaplan:
Uh-huh.
Jimmy Aquino:
But I don’t remember. They do talk a lot about the closing song, which is like sort of a poppy rock song. But not really much that I remember.
Mandy Kaplan:
Okay. Next time you watch it, keep an ear out for some music that feels like it’s too much.
So let’s talk about the Suzanne Collins of it all, because now we’re there.
Jimmy Aquino:
Oh, I have so many.
Mandy Kaplan:
We’re in the dome.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah.
Mandy Kaplan:
Do you really think she ripped this off?
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah. The book came out in 1999, and English translations were available shortly after. Film came out in 2000, 2001. It was shown at film festivals all over America, but not really released until almost 2010, I think. But it was definitely shown at a lot of film festivals.
Whether she heard of it, her editor heard of it, it had ideas — there’s way too many similarities from things like, “Oh, danger zones.” In Hunger Games they had to constantly be on the move. In Battle Royale, you couldn’t stay in one area or your collar would explode. After some time, they’d have danger zones like that. The danger zones didn’t have poisonous fog show up to kill them, because they in Hunger Games are not wearing these collars like that.
Mandy Kaplan:
Right.
Jimmy Aquino:
So they had that. The countdown, which was so menacing — the death countdown. They do that in Hunger Games as well. There’s — gosh, I have so many notes on it. It’s just like, there’s so many similarities. Obviously, kids killing each other is the main thing. Putting them off on some little island somewhere. There’s just too many.
Mandy Kaplan:
So I guess the word “ripoff” is what’s bothering me.
Jimmy Aquino:
Maybe not. I’ll give that caveat, but maybe not. Sure.
Mandy Kaplan:
Because if I read Romeo and Juliet, and then I write a beautiful love story that’s heartbreaking, it’s not necessarily a ripoff of Romeo and Juliet. There are these themes that we just see played over and over again in our art.
Jimmy Aquino:
Sure.
Mandy Kaplan:
So —
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah, I agree.
Mandy Kaplan:
When I read Hunger Games, I thought, “Lord of the Flies,” and she doesn’t acknowledge Lord of the Flies as an inspiration.
Jimmy Aquino:
Sure, of course, yes.
Mandy Kaplan:
So I just think that she could have read this book or seen this movie and thought, “Oh, that is a fascinating idea. What would I do with that idea?”
Jimmy Aquino:
“How can I whiten this up?” I mean — I’m just saying.
Mandy Kaplan:
Oh, whole other issue, yeah.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah.
Mandy Kaplan:
But I really don’t think it’s a ripoff the way you maybe believe it is.
Jimmy Aquino:
Well, it’s definitely not an homage. Like, I recently saw, obviously, all the recent Dracula — Luc Besson did. It was really good. He talks about it — it’s a clear homage to Coppola’s Dracula. So many similarities, but he said, “Yeah, I was really influenced by that film.”
Mandy Kaplan:
But people didn’t like that movie, I thought.
Jimmy Aquino:
Another thing. Which, the original Dracula was Coppola?
Mandy Kaplan:
Coppola’s Dracula.
Jimmy Aquino:
Are you kidding me?
Mandy Kaplan:
I thought people laughed at it.
Jimmy Aquino:
I love that film. That movie is — I think you need to look that up again, madam.
Mandy Kaplan:
Oh, okay.
Jimmy Aquino:
It was wildly popular, is what I remember. But please make tenuous notes. Maybe we can watch them both and compare them in a future episode.
I know he’s not the best reference right now, but on Louis C.K.’s old show, it’s widely known that — oh, god, the comedian that everyone said stole jokes. He always would be really quirky, and that was his comedy, and I never thought he was funny.
Mandy Kaplan:
Oh —
Jimmy Aquino:
God, what is his name?
Mandy Kaplan:
Dane Cook?
Jimmy Aquino:
Dane Cook, sorry, yes, Dane Cook, yeah. I’ve never thought he was funny, because I did feel his life stuff was derivative, and I found out later people said he’s clearly stealing jokes from other comedians. So Louis actually had him come on the show. If you ever saw Louis’s show —
Mandy Kaplan:
I did — not with Dane Cook, but —
Jimmy Aquino:
It was actually really good. He had Dane Cook come on because his daughter wanted to see him in concert. He takes the daughter to the concert, and he meets Dane backstage, and they address it. They’re in character on the show, but they’re playing a role themselves.
Mandy Kaplan:
Sure.
Jimmy Aquino:
He’s like, “Here’s the thing. I know people say you steal my jokes. In the future, here’s what I think. I think maybe you saw my comedy 15 years ago, 10, 20 years ago, and then 10 years later, you think of something, not realizing you got that idea from this. So that I understand.” So of course, Dane denied it, because he’s a joke stealer.
But I just feel like — yes, can two people have the same idea at the same time? Of course. But it just seems so similar. And I think a lot of it has to do with the fact that it’s Japanese and she’s white, and sometimes people are always appropriating and taking something in.
There are many adaptations that were supposed to happen over the years. The CW had a series planned, which I don’t know how that would have worked out. And there was going to be an American remake, of course, and all these just never worked out, which I’m kind of glad, because it’s such a classic film.
So I think it’s possible. I’m not outright saying she did it, but it just seems too similar. And so many people say the same thing, which makes it right, since so many of us say the same thing.
Mandy Kaplan:
Right. Well, so many people did not like Bram Stoker’s Dracula. Sixty-nine percent critics on Rotten Tomatoes, seventy-nine percent public. I’m just saying.
Jimmy Aquino:
Well, they’re the worst. I really love that film.
Mandy Kaplan:
They are. You’re right, they’re wrong. But I would also — and I’m not really arguing with you, Jimmy, because I totally see the similarities between Hunger Games and Battle Royale.
Jimmy Aquino:
I mean, yes.
Mandy Kaplan:
I’m not denying the similarities. But you look at Squid Game, and you wouldn’t say Squid Game is a ripoff of this. But there is a very similar — all these people wake up in this place, and they are facing their death, and they’re all numbered, right?
Jimmy Aquino:
Well, because — sure. Well, they created basically this movie, helped create sort of that genre, in a sense. So it has become this “battle royale” — where they’ve determined “battle royale” now kind of means that in film, where it’s sort of something like this, like Squid Game, like Alice in Borderland, a Japanese series they just ended. That was amazing. Three seasons, you should watch.
So there’s all sorts of Hunger Games — of course, there are some movies that are similar to it. And yeah, so there’s definitely a lot going on in it.
Mandy Kaplan:
Which I totally get. But I would also argue, didn’t the gladiators invent this type of thing? It’s not a whole brand new idea, people battling it out for other people’s entertainment — not children.
Jimmy Aquino:
Sure, but not children.
Mandy Kaplan:
Yeah.
Jimmy Aquino:
Unless you grew up where I grew up, then yes. I barely made it out, let me tell you. That’s why I’m wearing the uniform.
Mandy Kaplan:
I grew up on the mean streets of Framingham.
Jimmy Aquino:
Have you watched Ted, the series on Peacock? Ted takes place in my hometown.
Mandy Kaplan:
I love it.
Jimmy Aquino:
I like the movies. I want to watch — I haven’t watched the series yet though, so I want to check it out.
Mandy Kaplan:
It’s really funny. And it’s just bizarre to hear them saying, “Well, here in Framingham, we do things different,” because that’s my town.
Jimmy Aquino:
It doesn’t sound like a real city. Framingham.
Mandy Kaplan:
Framingham. Shout out Matt Warren, past guest.
Jimmy Aquino:
Framingham. I’m sure it’s the best.
Speaking of — I wanted to mention, did you recognize anyone in the film?
Mandy Kaplan:
I did not.
Jimmy Aquino:
Did you see Kill Bill?
Mandy Kaplan:
I did not.
Jimmy Aquino:
Okay, that’s why then.
Mandy Kaplan:
Okay.
Jimmy Aquino:
So Chiaki Kuriyama, who plays the runner, the knife-lick girl, where the guy tries to attack her, and she kills him and stabs him with her knife —
Mandy Kaplan:
Yes. Chigusa.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah, Chigusa. She plays in Kill Bill, like, Lucy Liu’s right-hand assassin, in a schoolgirl uniform.
Mandy Kaplan:
Ah.
Jimmy Aquino:
And she has this mace and ball. She has this giant fight with Uma Thurman’s character, and it’s really amazing. And Tarantino cast her because he saw Battle Royale. He had also written a role for the evil girl, Mitsuko, who is enjoying killing people.
Mandy Kaplan:
She was my favorite.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah, she’s great, right?
Mandy Kaplan:
Yeah. Oh my god, we’ll get there.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah.
Mandy Kaplan:
Yeah.
Jimmy Aquino:
He had written a role for her to play Gogo’s sister in Kill Bill. But Kill Bill is two films that are already like twenty hours long, and to come seek revenge — then it didn’t work out. I don’t know if they ever shot anything or not. But he took two — well, he wanted to take two of them from this film because he loved it so much.
Mandy Kaplan:
Yeah.
Jimmy Aquino:
But yes, Mitsuko. Ooh, god, she’s amazing.
Mandy Kaplan:
Let’s talk Mitsuko.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah, she’s great.
Mandy Kaplan:
So she is stunning and evil, and we see her in flashbacks being the mean — she’s the Regina George of the piece.
Jimmy Aquino:
But you also see the abuse she — okay, great.
Mandy Kaplan:
Well, I’m not there yet.
Jimmy Aquino:
Okay, gotcha.
Mandy Kaplan:
Initially, she’s just mean to Noriko at school. And then she’s so cunning, and she comes in — Noriko’s hiding, and it’s Noriko, right? And she comes in with a stun gun.
Jimmy Aquino:
No, that’s not Noriko.
Mandy Kaplan:
That’s not Noriko. Okay.
Jimmy Aquino:
No.
Mandy Kaplan:
Guys. So Mitsuko finds this girl hiding and does the old, “Come on, let’s team up. Let’s be pals, I’m not going to hurt you.” And she goes in, and then —
Jimmy Aquino:
“Let me see your stun gun.”
Mandy Kaplan:
And then there’s this instantaneous switch.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah, she does it a few times.
Mandy Kaplan:
They go from being school girls to — but they both do it. The choreography — they become cheetahs. The way they attack each other, it’s like you’re watching Animal Planet.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yes.
Mandy Kaplan:
It’s so beautifully choreographed. They’re climbing, and they don’t look human for a solid 10 seconds.
Jimmy Aquino:
Under a table, yeah.
Mandy Kaplan:
Yeah. And then Mitsuko kills her and doesn’t really feel any emotions about it. Just another day at the office for her.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah. And she does it again later with the girl that finds her — the girl that has the gun that finds her. She tries to pretend to cry, and the girl’s like, “Quit playing.” And then within an instant changes back to, “Fuck you. I came for the gun.”
Mandy Kaplan:
Oh, she’s so good.
Jimmy Aquino:
She’s great.
Mandy Kaplan:
The actress is so good. The character is so interesting.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah.
Mandy Kaplan:
And then we do flashback — help me out, because I’m trying to find my notes about it — to her childhood, where she killed a guy who tried to molest her.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah. Ooh. She’s probably five, I guess. Her mother’s a drunk. Her mother’s, like, almost passed out on the table drinking. Some creepy guy’s there, a bunch of money on the table. Clearly, her mother mutters something, and maybe her mother —
Mandy Kaplan:
Sold — yes.
Jimmy Aquino:
Sold her to have this happen. The guy goes upstairs and does this little thing with a doll and tries to molest her. Because he’s at the top of the stairs and she’s this little badass — she’s like five years old and just kind of shoves him off. And he falls down the stairs, and done. And then that shot of her at the top of the stairs — it’s a nice little foreshadow to what she turns into.
Mandy Kaplan:
Great casting too, because they look alike. So when they come back to present day, to Mitsuko, you’re like, “Oh, god. Okay. I see it. I see where she comes from and why she is this way.”
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah.
Mandy Kaplan:
Very powerful. I wanted her to get a spin-off. Spoiler alert, she doesn’t live.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah.
Mandy Kaplan:
She should get her own movie. She’s a badass.
Jimmy Aquino:
She continued working a lot for sure. I think she’s still active today.
Mandy Kaplan:
Yeah, she was my favorite. And then I wrote, “Damn it, now she’s dead.”
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah. I was pissed, because she killed my favorite, Chigusa — Chiaki Kuriyama.
Mandy Kaplan:
I wanted to watch her move through this till the very end, but she made it far.
Jimmy Aquino:
Who stabs the guy in his junk, and then runs off, and then Mitsuko shoots her, and then she ends up — dying. There’s all these little unrequited love moments at death, which are both sweet and sad.
Mandy Kaplan:
Yes.
Jimmy Aquino:
The guy comes, finds her, and she dies in his arms. It’s a really sweet moment. There’s another one where a girl shoots a guy, and he’s like, “I’ve always loved you. Why are you just now telling me? You never spoke to me.”
Mandy Kaplan:
Right.
Jimmy Aquino:
And it’s so sad.
Mandy Kaplan:
Because they’re just kids.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah. They’re horny, they’re fifteen.
Mandy Kaplan:
And so two of them find a megaphone, and they’re like, “Everybody come over here.”
Jimmy Aquino:
Oh, god. Dummies.
Mandy Kaplan:
And then one of them says, “Oh, there’s that boy you’ve always had a crush on.” And she’s like, “Shut up.”
Jimmy Aquino:
He seemed very popular.
Mandy Kaplan:
And they get in a little girl fight about, “Don’t tell him I have a crush on him.”
Jimmy Aquino:
Lots of girls seem to like him.
Mandy Kaplan:
Yes, but then they’re dead sixty seconds later.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah, because they announced where they were. Dummies.
Mandy Kaplan:
I know, so dumb. But it was extra heartbreaking, because they’re like, “Shut up. No, I don’t.” “Yes, you do. You have a crush on him.”
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah. They’re kids. Total kids.
Mandy Kaplan:
And then wham.
But let’s talk about Chigusa, to say it one more time.
Jimmy Aquino:
Chigusa.
Mandy Kaplan:
Chigusa. So the screen goes black, and then we see this beautiful young lady in a bright yellow jogging suit, jogging through a beautiful —
Jimmy Aquino:
Yes, why is she jogging through Deathland? Murderland. Aye, Murder Island.
Mandy Kaplan:
I assumed it was a dream sequence, and we were going to see her wake up.
Jimmy Aquino:
Well, it was. No, it was a flashback. It started out as a flashback, with her running in the suit and the guy behind her on the bike. That’s a flashback. And then she runs up towards the temple, and as she turns around, you see she has the collar on. But she’s in the same suit, because they had their clothes with them, because they had their personal bags too.
Mandy Kaplan:
So it was — okay.
Jimmy Aquino:
So they had their personal bags too with them.
Mandy Kaplan:
Right.
Jimmy Aquino:
So some of them changed. Mitsuko changed.
Mandy Kaplan:
So she wasn’t jogging on the island. She was just wearing her — she was.
Jimmy Aquino:
She was. Or maybe she wasn’t.
Mandy Kaplan:
Well, what kind of —
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah. Maybe she wasn’t jogging.
Mandy Kaplan:
Absolutely dumb to put on your bright yellow suit and go jogging for exercise when someone’s trying to murder you.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah. But it was established she was a runner.
Mandy Kaplan:
Yeah.
Jimmy Aquino:
So — yeah, I was like, “Why are you training on the island?” Even the guy that finds her questions, “Why are you running around?”
But yes, initially it is a flashback, and then they cleverly sort of — I guess I can see how it could be confusing — they immediately go from that shot, and they pan behind her. So I guess to establish that, “No, you’re here on the island now.” Because then you see the collar on her neck. When she’s running, and the guy’s on the bike, there’s no collars on them. They’re just hanging out, right?
Mandy Kaplan:
Okay.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah.
Mandy Kaplan:
Yeah, I guess I didn’t look at the collars. But when he catches her on the island, I wrote, “Oh god, it’s going to be ‘Let’s do it for our country.'” He’s trying to hook up.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah.
Mandy Kaplan:
You know, it’s like, “We’re going to die, let’s just make the most of it right now.”
Jimmy Aquino:
“Don’t you want to before you die, come on.”
Mandy Kaplan:
And then she stabs him in the junk.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yes, exactly.
Mandy Kaplan:
Whoa.
Jimmy Aquino:
Which rightfully so, because he clearly even said, “I could just take you.” Basically saying, “I’m going to —”
Mandy Kaplan:
Yes.
Jimmy Aquino:
“I’m going to jump on you.”
Mandy Kaplan:
“I’m going to r— you.”
Jimmy Aquino:
“I’m going to rape you,” basically, sorry to say the word.
Mandy Kaplan:
Yeah.
Jimmy Aquino:
He basically says that in so many words. And she’s like, “Come at me. I will fuck you up.” And it was so great, because she immediately turns, and he accidentally shoots at her and gets the side of her face with an arrow. And the blood — there’s that old Bruce Lee thing where the blood, and all of a sudden you’re like, “Oh, you fucked up now. It is on.”
She says, “Come at me. I will resist you with every inch of my body. Give it a shot.” And I was like, “Oh, that’s my girl, Chigusa.” I was so glad she got him, but I was so mad that Mitsuko got her too.
Mandy Kaplan:
Yeah.
Jimmy Aquino:
I was like, “Oh.” Yeah, it’s an intense moment.
Mandy Kaplan:
I want to ask you, do you have a sense of who had the most kills? Certainly the JD from Heathers.
Jimmy Aquino:
Oh, Kiriyama. No, no, Kawada’s the nice one.
Mandy Kaplan:
That’s him. Right, but JD — the other one.
Jimmy Aquino:
Who you said was JD. Oh, you said Kiriyama was JD. Oh, I thought you meant you said Kawada was JD.
Mandy Kaplan:
Well, they both were in the first scene, because they were both just brooding.
Jimmy Aquino:
Okay. The one with the blondish hair with the highlights, that’s the crazy one. That’s the one you’re saying is JD. Okay, my bad. I think Kawada — so definitely him, Kiriyama. He probably had the most, because he would show up every time.
Mandy Kaplan:
Yes.
Jimmy Aquino:
He’d hear a noise and would kill somebody. He killed the two girls with the megaphone. He would always show up.
Mandy Kaplan:
And he fashioned a bulletproof vest, somehow.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah, well, he got it off somebody he killed. Remember, he shot at a guy, and the guy pretended to be dead and starts laughing, and he opens his shirt. And he says, “Oh, I get it.” Then you see the next shot, Kiriyama standing over him.
Mandy Kaplan:
Okay. Right.
Jimmy Aquino:
“Uh-huh. Now you’re dead, and I get your bulletproof vest.” That was the whole idea — anytime you kill somebody, you want to take what they have, right? Because it might be a better weapon.
Mandy Kaplan:
Mm-hmm.
Jimmy Aquino:
So the guy had a bulletproof vest, so he took the vest, so then he had the vest.
Mandy Kaplan:
It’s like anytime the caterer comes out with anything, I take it. Because you don’t know — like, it’s a pig in a blanket.
Jimmy Aquino:
Well, yes — not those crappy little — bring me the good stuff back around, exactly.
Mandy Kaplan:
I don’t know if a crab cake is coming next. I don’t know, so I’m going to take this.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yes.
Mandy Kaplan:
I want to take a business pause and let everybody know that Make Me a Nerd is a production of TruStory FM. Engineering by the peerless Pete Wright. My theme song is Wonderstruck by Jane in the Boy. If you like what you’re hearing, please leave a five-star review on Apple Podcasts and write a message in there. Ask a question, tell me what you want me to try next, and I will give you a shout-out on the air.
And if you’re feeling really supportive, hey, go to makemeanerd.com/join, and hitting that button will get you your episodes ad-free and early, and my eternal gratitude.
Jimmy, while we’re here, where can everybody find Comic News Insider?
Jimmy Aquino:
At comicnewsinsider.com. You can find me on Instagram at Jimmy Aquino. I’m mostly on Instagram and Bluesky these days. We record every week — news, reviews, interviews. I do conventions, etc. We just recorded our 1,700th episode. We’ve been going since — our 21-year anniversary is in April. Celebrated 20 last year, obviously.
Mandy Kaplan:
Wow.
Jimmy Aquino:
It’s super fun hobby. I love it. If you want to send me money, sure, go ahead. See me in the street, just throw some money on me. I’ll take it. Mandy pays me a lot for this, but I can still use a little more.
Mandy Kaplan:
Yes.
Jimmy Aquino:
I appreciate it.
Mandy Kaplan:
Wow, 1,700 episodes.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah.
Mandy Kaplan:
And you really cover not just comic books and superheroes, but a lot of pop culture.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah, it’s become very pop culture.
Mandy Kaplan:
Entertainment, yeah. So everybody should — you can do whatever the fuck you want, it’s your podcast. So everybody, go listen to Comic News Insider, please and thank you.
Jimmy Aquino:
I cover K-pop if I want to, whatever. That’s right. Yes, thank you.
So, the teacher and Noriko — what are your thoughts on that?
Mandy Kaplan:
I was very confused. There’s a flashback with a Frank Capra blur on the lens, and they’re sharing a popsicle.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah.
Mandy Kaplan:
And I was like, “What is happening?”
Jimmy Aquino:
Now, did you see the extra scenes at the end of the film? With that on the version you watched?
Mandy Kaplan:
Yeah.
Jimmy Aquino:
There are some post-credit scenes — again, did it before Avengers. Post-credit scenes. There are three of them. I’m not sure if any of them appeared in the actual theater, but I have several DVDs, and they appear on the DVD.
So one flashback is just of Shuya not remembering a basketball game that we saw early on. And then another one where he’s on the basketball court, and he sees Nobu, who’s dead.
Mandy Kaplan:
Oh, yeah, I did see that.
Jimmy Aquino:
But then there’s the scene — because early on, they show that flashback scene where there’s no dialogue between the teacher and Noriko. And at the end, they show a flashback of them, you can hear the dialogue, them talking, right?
Mandy Kaplan:
Mm-hmm.
Jimmy Aquino:
Did you see that one?
Mandy Kaplan:
I think I saw dialogue.
Jimmy Aquino:
They’re talking, and she’s like, “Oh, by the way, I kept the knife.” He’s like, “What is an adult supposed to say to that?” And that sort of ends up — you see that in a very brief moment that the teacher has a call from his daughter.
Mandy Kaplan:
Yes.
Jimmy Aquino:
He clearly has trouble at home. The mother is sick, and maybe he’s neglectful.
Mandy Kaplan:
Yes.
Jimmy Aquino:
The daughter clearly fucking hates him.
Mandy Kaplan:
Hates him, yeah.
Jimmy Aquino:
So he has sort of imprinted, in a sense, on Noriko, seeing her as his daughter. He’s got this fatherly love for her. I don’t think it’s anything creepy. Well, I guess maybe a little bit. But he has this fatherly love for her where he wants to take care of her. There’s even a moment during the game, he shows up with an umbrella because it’s raining, to put over her head at some point.
Mandy Kaplan:
But my question was, why didn’t she kill him?
Jimmy Aquino:
And then we also —
Mandy Kaplan:
Why don’t they kill him? He’s wandering around in the rain during the game by himself.
Jimmy Aquino:
Because — well, I think you forgot. You saw Mitsuko’s reaction. She’s scared to death of him, because she doesn’t know — also, he has the little button for the collars. Remember, he had the little remote control? So he probably had that. So they assume he has that on, and he probably does. I’m sure there — we don’t see, but I’m sure maybe there’s a soldier or two behind him, hiding somewhere.
Mandy Kaplan:
Yeah, maybe.
Jimmy Aquino:
He clearly cares about her. He says, “You’re the only one that they’re really nice to me.” She was always kind of nice to him, I guess, because you see in the beginning, she’s the only one that shows up for class, and she’s like, “Oh, what happened?”
And then you see at the end what happens, right, where he wanted her to win, because he did a fucking painting of this brutal painting —
Mandy Kaplan:
A very weird — oh, it was weird.
Jimmy Aquino:
All the kids dead and killing each other, and her with an angelic halo glaze, has survived.
Mandy Kaplan:
And she’s in the middle, surrounded by sunshine.
Jimmy Aquino:
So he was clearly wanting her to survive. I feel like he would have went out of his way to help her survive, had she been more in trouble.
What did you think of that? Did you find it creepy? Did you think it was just sort of a thing where people, “Oh, you kind of remind me of my daughter,” or, “I like you, and I wish you were my daughter” type thing?
Mandy Kaplan:
I almost wish it went further. I wish we knew more about the teacher to get some level of, “Oh god, he’s so broken. I see why he’s doing this.” It wasn’t enough for me to really leave an imprint.
One question I had that I mentioned earlier, but we didn’t go into it, is I thought this was a dystopian story. And maybe I don’t know what dystopian means. Isn’t it futuristic, like a bleak future? Or does it not have to do with the future?
Jimmy Aquino:
I don’t think it has to do with the future. I could be wrong.
Mandy Kaplan:
Oh.
Jimmy Aquino:
There’s rare occasions where I could be wrong.
Mandy Kaplan:
Okay. Because it felt very present day for ’99 or 2000.
Jimmy Aquino:
No, it was present day. It wasn’t like far-off sci-fi in the future. Everything was very present day.
Mandy Kaplan:
Yeah.
Jimmy Aquino:
I don’t think it needs to be in the future. I think it needs to be more just sort of like a nightmarish landscape.
Mandy Kaplan:
Yes, that’s a great way to describe it.
Jimmy Aquino:
Run by authority figures, like Hunger Games.
Mandy Kaplan:
Okay. Like mankind has undergone a huge shift in turmoil.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah, exactly. I mean, some might say we’re currently in one, so you know, I’m just saying.
Mandy Kaplan:
Yeah.
Jimmy Aquino:
You do hear that, like, “a dystopian sci-fi future” type thing. That is a very common theme. But yeah, I don’t think this is considered — it’s definitely not future. It’s definitely now.
Mandy Kaplan:
Okay. And then lastly, the very last thing I saw was there’s a sequel.
Jimmy Aquino:
It’s terrible, so do not watch it.
Mandy Kaplan:
Okay.
Jimmy Aquino:
So the sequel — everyone was very excited because, especially after all the hype, we were like, “Yes, bring it on, a sequel.” It was bad. What are my notes? I have some quick notes on that.
It’s Battle Royale II: Requiem. Came out in 2003, a few years later. Kinji Fukasaku, who directed the first one, died after only shooting one scene with Beat Takeshi. So his son, Kenta, who co-wrote the script, took over, made his directing debut. Nothing to do with the novel — it’s just sort of they based on the original one.
So basically now, as we see at the end of the film, Nanahara and Noriko are on the run because they’re wanted by the government.
Mandy Kaplan:
Right.
Jimmy Aquino:
So this plays on —
Mandy Kaplan:
For murder, which — are you kidding me?
Jimmy Aquino:
Like, you put them on that island.
Mandy Kaplan:
Yes.
Jimmy Aquino:
I think maybe because of the murder of the teacher, maybe that’s why. Because he wasn’t part of the game officially.
Mandy Kaplan:
Right, but also two people aren’t supposed to win, so I guess I don’t know.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah, that too. They want to cover it up.
Mandy Kaplan:
Mm-hmm.
Jimmy Aquino:
So they’re now international terrorists trying to bring down the Japanese government. They formed this sort of underground — him and other Battle Royale winners, including the smiling girl from the previous one. She has a role in this one, which is nice to see.
Mandy Kaplan:
Oh, okay.
Jimmy Aquino:
So they’re holed up on another island. This time, a class gets kidnapped, but their role is not to kill each other, it’s to kill the terrorists. But they do a weird thing where they have the necklaces, the collars, but they’re paired up.
Mandy Kaplan:
Oh, to hunt. Okay.
Jimmy Aquino:
And a really weird thing — if one gets killed, the other one is automatically killed. You have to be paired together. It was like a lot of bad overacting. It got a lot of hate because there’s a very anti-American feel to it, which whatever. But it wasn’t a great script.
There is a bit where you see a flashback with the teacher and his daughter, and she is part of the commando force —
Mandy Kaplan:
Oh, okay.
Jimmy Aquino:
— that wants to take out the terrorists. So you get a little more about it, but it doesn’t really make up for it.
Mandy Kaplan:
Yeah.
Jimmy Aquino:
It didn’t have that “who will die” suspense to it.
Mandy Kaplan:
Right.
Jimmy Aquino:
It was pretty widely panned. You don’t need to see it. It’s fine.
Mandy Kaplan:
Well, I’m glad I saw this one. It does feel like a cultural touch point. It feels like it influenced a lot after it, and it was very enjoyable, and it really messed with my head in a good way. That said, I watched so much of it through my little fingers, because it was so bloody and so violent. But a real mind fuck in a great way.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yes.
Mandy Kaplan:
So thank you. I never would have known about this. And I really appreciate you reaching out. And anybody listening can say, “Oh, that’s how this works.”
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah.
Mandy Kaplan:
Just reach out to me. Get me on Instagram, at Mandy underscore Kaplan underscore Clavens, both with K’s. And just say, “Hey, have you ever seen this movie? Because I think that could make a great discussion.” And come on the podcast and nerdify me.
Jimmy Aquino:
Hashtag no jerks. We don’t want any jerks on here.
But also, just real quick — it was also adapted into a manga about five, six years later, with many volumes. I had, I remember, the first two, three volumes, and I sold my whole collection years and years ago, or most of my collection. But it was really sexualized, which was really disturbing, because they’re supposed to be kids.
Mandy Kaplan:
They’re supposed to be thirteen.
Jimmy Aquino:
So it was a lot of — like, thirteen to fifteen years old. I started at ten.
Mandy Kaplan:
Yeah.
Jimmy Aquino:
But whatever, they were not — let’s play that Fisher Price music, it gets it going. I don’t know what I’m saying. I have no idea what that means.
Mandy Kaplan:
Again, the views of Jimmy Aquino don’t reflect the views of Make Me a Nerd.
Jimmy Aquino:
I know. I’m having all these traumatic memories pop up. But yeah, so it just — really not for me, not great. But they keep talking about trying to adapt it. We’ll see what happens.
Mandy Kaplan:
Okay.
Jimmy Aquino:
So we did get a little insight into what you would do.
Mandy Kaplan:
Well, keep me posted.
Jimmy Aquino:
How do you think — you know, if this really happened, how do you think you’d react? You would not be waiting outside the door. I know you’re saying that, but you would not be the one waiting outside the door. What would you do?
Mandy Kaplan:
Oh god, this kind of talk actually freaks me out.
Jimmy Aquino:
Oh, okay.
Mandy Kaplan:
Some of the kids kill themselves, which is — they don’t want to kill anybody.
Jimmy Aquino:
You don’t have to talk about it.
Mandy Kaplan:
I wouldn’t want to kill anybody, so I would hide as long as possible.
Jimmy Aquino:
Yeah.
Mandy Kaplan:
And then get killed. Somebody would find me and kill me while I was begging and crying and shitting myself.
Jimmy Aquino:
Okay. All right.
Mandy Kaplan:
How about you, Jimmy?
Jimmy Aquino:
I’d be waiting outside the door.
Mandy Kaplan:
Yeah. Okay.
Jimmy Aquino:
No, I would probably team up like most people did, and try to — I would think I would try to be more Nanahara, like more like Shuya. But I feel like, even though he had played the game before, I’d want to be like Kawada, where I want to find a way off and try people to team up with.
Mandy Kaplan:
Yeah.
Jimmy Aquino:
But also, I don’t think I’d be afraid to take somebody off that came at me. I think it would freak me out at first, but then I’d be like, “Okay, well, I would Mitsuko the crap out of it, like, what’s up?”
Mandy Kaplan:
Right. That’s the name of the game. Yep. Oh, she was the best. Okay.
Jimmy Aquino:
Anyway, yeah.
Mandy Kaplan:
I adore you. Thank you for coming on the podcast again.
Jimmy Aquino:
I adore me too. I mean, adore you too, yes.
Mandy Kaplan:
Everybody listen to Comic News Insider.
Jimmy Aquino:
Okay.
Mandy Kaplan:
And thank you all for listening.
